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EPPING: 'Ghetto' homes: first pictures
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| An artist's impression of the controversial development |
THESE are the first pictures of the controversial homes which developers want to build on the former St Margaret's Hospital site.
The overall proposal, for 351 properties, has sparked fury among local people and a campaign to fight it is well under way.
They say the plans resemble a "ghetto" and are unhappy at the proposed size of some of the apartment blocks.
Richard Burrows, managing director of Bellway Homes, told the Guardian he believed they were "well designed". But Epping Forest MP Eleanor Laing disagreed and instead branded the scheme "inappropriate and unacceptable".
Reader Poll
Does this homes plan for Epping resemble a ghetto?
Yes
67.1% |  | No
32.9% |  |
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Opposition has focused on the scale of the development, and fears over whether the town can cope with more residents.
But following a public display of the plans, Mr Burrows has sought to allay
concerns and win the Epping community over.
He said: "The sewers and services are of adequate capacity to serve the site. The principle of development was established a number of years ago with the grant of outline planning permission, which essentially crystallised the residential potential of this site.
"To date, the scheme has been driven by English Partnerships and their need to provide the homes which are needed within the east of England.
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| The entrance to the proposed build |
"I believe the scheme has been very well designed and do not consider it to be over-developed. It's in line with the best practice and development of a brownfield site. The site proposals are not out of character with the previous development of the plot."
Access to the scheme will be via a new traffic light controlled junction onto The Plain.
Gillian Eastman, 63, of Hartland Road, in Epping, said: "It's ludicrous. If you look at the traffic now it's bad and there will be no doctors' surgeries. It's going to be too large. I've lived here 27 years and it's going to spoil the town.
"You've got to look at Epping now and you can't park anywhere - it's going to make it worse.
"I think anybody looking at the proposals will say it's too big and it will spoil the character of the town."
Derek Ball, 63, of The Plain - a supporter of the Plainly Say No campaign - said: "It directly affects me as it's going to be built on the back of my property. It's too high rise. The impact is going to be huge because it's a big development."
Opponents are worried about the height of some of the buildings and that the town's services will not be able to cope with the extra influx of people.
Danny Brown, 64, from Epping, said: "They've not even applied for a doctors or school. It's terrible, we've lived here 40 years and you can't keep bringing people in. The problem is the influx of people. I feel sad for my grandchildren, what are they going to do? It will force them out. You can understand why people go to live in Spain."
Mavis Ellis, 80, of Egg Hall, in Epping, said: "It looks like it has been built in the 1800s and somewhere everybody has to live because they're working in a factory environment, not in the middle of Epping. It's not what Epping wants. They won't sell them. There will be too much traffic."
Tony Carr, 69, of Centre Drive, in Epping, said: "I think the pictures look very nice and it will be an ideal development for an urban town centre where people could walk to offices, shops and stations, but it's not for Epping.
"It's going to be a difficult problem with traffic and what about school places?"
But Jan Sullivan, 57, from Ongar, said: "I think it looks very nice. It's land that can be used and we need more properties in the area.
"I think it looks really good and I'm looking forward to it. I'm in Epping all the time because this is my local town and I have three daughters and they have a chance to move to the area they know and this is perfect.
"We don't want to move out, we want to stay here. They are new and modern homes which is what young people want."
It is not yet known when the plans will be discussed by district councillors.
10:00am Thursday 27th March 2008
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CommentPosted by: Morris Hickey, Chigwell (Redbridge) on 10:17am Thu 27 Mar 08
Anybody who is in any doubt about the monstrosities that Bellway are apable of building need look only at the former King George Hospital site in Eastern Avenue, Newbury Park in order to see a prime example of their "work"; a purpose-built slum.
Anybody who is in any doubt about the monstrosities that Bellway are apable of building need look only at the former King George Hospital site in Eastern Avenue, Newbury Park in order to see a prime example of their "work"; a purpose-built slum.
Posted by: Cllr. Ben Murphy - Deputy Mayor of Epping, Epping on 11:41am Thu 27 Mar 08
As Epping Town Council has previously stated, the current plans are an overdevelopment of this site and we believe there should be more family housing and less flats within a more natural environment in keeping with the sites rural surroundings. It was also felt that there could be problems with the access route, as well as significant problems for Epping’s infrastructure.
Our Council has highlighted Theydon Grove as an estate where the design of the development had been well thought out and believe that the opportunity for a flagship development in character with the town in this part of Epping had been lost by Bellway’s current application.
It is my personal belief that if Bellway Homes were to reduce the number of dwelling from 351 to around 250, this would be a good start. I would also like to see no 4 storey level developments at all on this site – with the roof in the current plans this takes us to 5.5 storeys high which is totally unacceptable. We then need Bellway Homes to try and make these properties more unique and in keeping with the rural surroundings instead of the current “one size fits all” colour scheme and design. We also need to ask this developer to look again at the parking spaces provided. The Government’s usually unhelpful allowance of 1 car per household and no parking for visitors doesn’t work in rural communities like Epping.
Finally, we need to look carefully at the effect this will have on our infrastructure. Do we have capacity within our doctor’s surgeries, our schools, our hospitals? We have low water pressure in Epping. Will this cause this situation to worsen? Is this fair?
I have urged Bellway Homes to look again at their proposals and come forward with a more sympathetic, more appropriate design which will enhance our community, not hinder it. If they refuse I will fight tooth and nail to ensure that this planning application is refused.
As Epping Town Council has previously stated, the current plans are an overdevelopment of this site and we believe there should be more family housing and less flats within a more natural environment in keeping with the sites rural surroundings. It was also felt that there could be problems with the access route, as well as significant problems for Epping’s infrastructure.
Our Council has highlighted Theydon Grove as an estate where the design of the development had been well thought out and believe that the opportunity for a flagship development in character with the town in this part of Epping had been lost by Bellway’s current application.
It is my personal belief that if Bellway Homes were to reduce the number of dwelling from 351 to around 250, this would be a good start. I would also like to see no 4 storey level developments at all on this site – with the roof in the current plans this takes us to 5.5 storeys high which is totally unacceptable. We then need Bellway Homes to try and make these properties more unique and in keeping with the rural surroundings instead of the current “one size fits all” colour scheme and design. We also need to ask this developer to look again at the parking spaces provided. The Government’s usually unhelpful allowance of 1 car per household and no parking for visitors doesn’t work in rural communities like Epping.
Finally, we need to look carefully at the effect this will have on our infrastructure. Do we have capacity within our doctor’s surgeries, our schools, our hospitals? We have low water pressure in Epping. Will this cause this situation to worsen? Is this fair?
I have urged Bellway Homes to look again at their proposals and come forward with a more sympathetic, more appropriate design which will enhance our community, not hinder it. If they refuse I will fight tooth and nail to ensure that this planning application is refused.
Posted by: Walthamster, E17 on 1:49pm Thu 27 Mar 08
Best of luck to the protesters. I'm glad you've got the deputy mayor on your side, at least. Here in Walthamstow the council treats local residents as an annoying wastge of space.
Walthamstow too is under threat of several huge developments. They will cram more people into an already crowded area with no thought of facilities, road use, pressure on existing resources etc.
All those expenses will be met by the tax-payers, and all the profit goes to the developers.
Best of luck to the protesters. I'm glad you've got the deputy mayor on your side, at least. Here in Walthamstow the council treats local residents as an annoying wastge of space.
Walthamstow too is under threat of several huge developments. They will cram more people into an already crowded area with no thought of facilities, road use, pressure on existing resources etc.
All those expenses will be met by the tax-payers, and all the profit goes to the developers.
Posted by: Mr khalid, walthamstow on 1:56pm Thu 27 Mar 08
this belway have buget and can only bildeded the house for buget have? land prices to expense and so have to make corners cutting. how you say this look like getto i do not understand becose looks ok desine
this belway have buget and can only bildeded the house for buget have? land prices to expense and so have to make corners cutting. how you say this look like getto i do not understand becose looks ok desine
Posted by: Morris Hickey on 2:48pm Thu 27 Mar 08
I'm afraid, Ben Murphy, you have unwittingly or otherwise hit the nail on the head. You refer to a flagship development. That you will not get - it's Bellway we're talking about. They're the property development equivalent of Tesco - pile 'em high and build 'em cheap (but then flog them sky high).
I'm afraid, Ben Murphy, you have unwittingly or otherwise hit the nail on the head. You refer to a flagship development. That you will not get - it's Bellway we're talking about. They're the property development equivalent of Tesco - pile 'em high and build 'em cheap (but then flog them sky high).
Posted by: Cllr. Ben Murphy, Epping on 3:16pm Thu 27 Mar 08
We're not dealing with this application in a negative way at all. We appreciate that housing will be put on this site – we just have to find the right balance and I believe all of our Councillors and our Member of Parliament are right behind resident on this.
There is still a huge amount of negotiation to be done and the Council do have powers to ensure that the things that need to be done, will be done. They can attach building regulations and negotiate a section 106 agreement to ensure the developer provides the correct level of funding to meet the infrastructural needs.
This is going to take some time, but we are absolutely committed to getting this right for Epping.
We're not dealing with this application in a negative way at all. We appreciate that housing will be put on this site – we just have to find the right balance and I believe all of our Councillors and our Member of Parliament are right behind resident on this.
There is still a huge amount of negotiation to be done and the Council do have powers to ensure that the things that need to be done, will be done. They can attach building regulations and negotiate a section 106 agreement to ensure the developer provides the correct level of funding to meet the infrastructural needs.
This is going to take some time, but we are absolutely committed to getting this right for Epping.
Posted by: George, Epping on 3:53pm Thu 27 Mar 08
Lets hope the "negotiation" goes better than it did with the McCarthy & Stone carbuncle!
Epping should have a development like Chigwell is going to have at Grange Farm. Problem is the developer, Bellway Homes isn't a high class house builder, they specialise in building high density housing (mostly flats) of a poor quality.
Just Google them to see how many people are unhappy with Bellway Homes!
Lets hope the "negotiation" goes better than it did with the McCarthy & Stone carbuncle!
Epping should have a development like Chigwell is going to have at Grange Farm. Problem is the developer, Bellway Homes isn't a high class house builder, they specialise in building high density housing (mostly flats) of a poor quality.
Just Google them to see how many people are unhappy with Bellway Homes!
Posted by: George, Epping on 4:05pm Thu 27 Mar 08
Quick question, was the architect on holiday when they came up with this?
It does not fit in with the historic market town of Epping, looks like something being built in inner London.
Why can't the council push for them to build a unique development that would fit in with Epping?
Is it because it would cost Bellway Home money, rather than going to 'Model B' in there book of moulds?
Quick question, was the architect on holiday when they came up with this?
It does not fit in with the historic market town of Epping, looks like something being built in inner London.
Why can't the council push for them to build a unique development that would fit in with Epping?
Is it because it would cost Bellway Home money, rather than going to 'Model B' in there book of moulds?
Posted by: B Hornett, Coopersale on 5:41pm Fri 28 Mar 08
Being an ex Bellway home owner in Chelmsford I can confirm that this developer is known for over development without consideration for logistics, environment and local ethos.
Keep Epping green and rural.
Being an ex Bellway home owner in Chelmsford I can confirm that this developer is known for over development without consideration for logistics, environment and local ethos.
Keep Epping green and rural.
Posted by: Colin, Epping on 12:14am Sun 30 Mar 08
I agree that this site should be re-developed for housing. What I do not accept is the scale and nature of the development.
The developer has dramatically increased the number of housing units from the original planning permission, which they will clearly benefit from financially. However, Epping shall have to live with the consequences for decades.
An over-developed site like this will not be somewhere where people will want to live long term. It will be transitory, particularly if sold to buy-to-let investors, leading to all sorts of problems a few years down the road.
If this site is to be developed, it must be somewhere where people want to settle and be proud of. And it must be sympathetic with the surroundings, right next to green belt and the lower forest.
The developer must be made to understand their responsibilities in protecting this sensitive area, and the towns community.
I agree that this site should be re-developed for housing. What I do not accept is the scale and nature of the development.
The developer has dramatically increased the number of housing units from the original planning permission, which they will clearly benefit from financially. However, Epping shall have to live with the consequences for decades.
An over-developed site like this will not be somewhere where people will want to live long term. It will be transitory, particularly if sold to buy-to-let investors, leading to all sorts of problems a few years down the road.
If this site is to be developed, it must be somewhere where people want to settle and be proud of. And it must be sympathetic with the surroundings, right next to green belt and the lower forest.
The developer must be made to understand their responsibilities in protecting this sensitive area, and the towns community.
Posted by: bob, Epping on 5:35pm Mon 31 Mar 08
Why are Bellway homes the only alternative? There should be proper competition between developers for the best project for the town. Who owns the land currently and what is their financial interest? Perhaps the council can answer these questions. Mr Deputy mayor, do you have a view in this?
Why are Bellway homes the only alternative? There should be proper competition between developers for the best project for the town. Who owns the land currently and what is their financial interest? Perhaps the council can answer these questions. Mr Deputy mayor, do you have a view in this?
Posted by: Cllr. Ben Murphy, Epping on 9:23am Tue 1 Apr 08
Bob, I certainly do. The land was sold by the Primary Care Trust who run St. Margaret's Hospital to English Partnership, which is a Government quango designed to introduce as many new homes as possible in the UK.
It is English Partnership who have selected Bellway Homes as their preferred development partner.
English Partnership's press release of 21st March 2007 reads:
"The regeneration of the 5.56 ha site, will provide around 320 homes, 30 per cent of which will be for affordable sale or rent. The homes will be built to high environmental standards, achieving an Ecohomes rating of ‘very good’."
I hope this is the information you were requesting.
Bob, I certainly do. The land was sold by the Primary Care Trust who run St. Margaret's Hospital to English Partnership, which is a Government quango designed to introduce as many new homes as possible in the UK.
It is English Partnership who have selected Bellway Homes as their preferred development partner.
English Partnership's press release of 21st March 2007 reads:
"The regeneration of the 5.56 ha site, will provide around 320 homes, 30 per cent of which will be for affordable sale or rent. The homes will be built to high environmental standards, achieving an Ecohomes rating of ‘very good’."
I hope this is the information you were requesting.
Posted by: Morris Hickey, Chigwell (Redbridge) on 10:46am Tue 1 Apr 08
But experience suggests that "high environmental standards" (in the broadest sense) and Bellway Homes are mutually exclusive.
But experience suggests that "high environmental standards" (in the broadest sense) and Bellway Homes are mutually exclusive.
Posted by: James Slater, Epping on 11:31am Tue 1 Apr 08
It depends how you define "environment" doesn't it. I'm sure this simply means, environmenally friendly as in carbon neutral, well insulated etc. As opposed to well designed in keeping with the local rural environment...
It depends how you define "environment" doesn't it. I'm sure this simply means, environmenally friendly as in carbon neutral, well insulated etc. As opposed to well designed in keeping with the local rural environment...
Posted by: Bartok, Leyton on 4:10pm Tue 1 Apr 08
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats
Posted by: CH on 10:54pm Tue 1 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Bartok[/bold] wrote:
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats[/quote] Where can you rent one? Try the outskirts of Prague.
Bartok wrote:
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats
Where can you rent one? Try the outskirts of Prague.
Posted by: George, Epping on 12:01am Wed 2 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Bartok[/bold] wrote:
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats[/quote] FYI Epping isn't London! That is half the problem, the development is totally unsuitable for a semi-rural town like Epping.
Bartok wrote:
This flat looking nice why peoples complaning for it? It look better than many old building have in UK London. I like to know where I can rent this flats
FYI Epping isn't London! That is half the problem, the development is totally unsuitable for a semi-rural town like Epping.
Posted by: Luke Wildey, Egg Hall, Epping on 3:02pm Wed 2 Apr 08
Sorry, but this is all a load of tosh!
Epping needs more homes. Whoever suggested that the plans look like a 'ghetto' have never been to South East London or many of the other deprived area's in this country. Epping is an area with class, history and too many people who don't work and have nothing better to do. Find something more interesting to do, like collecting the rubbish that collects on the Forest's edge or helping to prevent deer from running into the road. I rent; I can't afford to buy because unlike most Epping residents I don't have access to a spare £16k to use for legal/surveying fees and a deposit. To build these homes on land that isn't used for anything worthwhile is a stroke of genius. Thank you whoever developed this plan, and I applaud all those that support it.
Sorry, but this is all a load of tosh!
Epping needs more homes. Whoever suggested that the plans look like a 'ghetto' have never been to South East London or many of the other deprived area's in this country. Epping is an area with class, history and too many people who don't work and have nothing better to do. Find something more interesting to do, like collecting the rubbish that collects on the Forest's edge or helping to prevent deer from running into the road. I rent; I can't afford to buy because unlike most Epping residents I don't have access to a spare £16k to use for legal/surveying fees and a deposit. To build these homes on land that isn't used for anything worthwhile is a stroke of genius. Thank you whoever developed this plan, and I applaud all those that support it.
Posted by: Ben Murphy, Epping on 4:01pm Wed 2 Apr 08
Hi Luke,
I welcome your comments on this development.
I can say, in all honesty, that apart from Jan Sullivan, 57, from Ongar, you are the only other person I have heard support the current planning application.
I wholeheartedly agree that Epping does need more homes to allow our own young people the opportunity to get a run on the property ladder and we have faught hard to ensure we have a mixture of affordable and social housing. In the outline planning persmission which has been granted for this site, 25% is "affordable", which should be both rented and buy-to-let.
I am very aware of the need and the potential use of this site, but the balance has to be right as this site will have an impact on many other factors within the town and we have to work through these issues before we can proceed.
One example is that the design one has 1 car parking space per residential unit - even if it is a 5 bedroom family home. There is no visitor parking at all. Just because the Government want this to be an "echofriendly" development, it doesn't mean that in practice it will work and it is my responsibility to ensure that this development will still be working successfully in 50 or 100 years time!
Hi Luke,
I welcome your comments on this development.
I can say, in all honesty, that apart from Jan Sullivan, 57, from Ongar, you are the only other person I have heard support the current planning application.
I wholeheartedly agree that Epping does need more homes to allow our own young people the opportunity to get a run on the property ladder and we have faught hard to ensure we have a mixture of affordable and social housing. In the outline planning persmission which has been granted for this site, 25% is "affordable", which should be both rented and buy-to-let.
I am very aware of the need and the potential use of this site, but the balance has to be right as this site will have an impact on many other factors within the town and we have to work through these issues before we can proceed.
One example is that the design one has 1 car parking space per residential unit - even if it is a 5 bedroom family home. There is no visitor parking at all. Just because the Government want this to be an "echofriendly" development, it doesn't mean that in practice it will work and it is my responsibility to ensure that this development will still be working successfully in 50 or 100 years time!
Posted by: James Roberts, Epping on 5:07pm Wed 2 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Luke Wildey[/bold] wrote:
Sorry, but this is all a load of tosh!
Epping needs more homes. Whoever suggested that the plans look like a 'ghetto' have never been to South East London or many of the other deprived area's in this country. Epping is an area with class, history and too many people who don't work and have nothing better to do. Find something more interesting to do, like collecting the rubbish that collects on the Forest's edge or helping to prevent deer from running into the road. I rent; I can't afford to buy because unlike most Epping residents I don't have access to a spare £16k to use for legal/surveying fees and a deposit. To build these homes on land that isn't used for anything worthwhile is a stroke of genius. Thank you whoever developed this plan, and I applaud all those that support it. [/quote] My I suggest if you are so unhappy with the people of Epping standing and be counted and caring about their town. How about a move to Harlow? Housing is very cheap there.
Luke Wildey wrote:
Sorry, but this is all a load of tosh!
Epping needs more homes. Whoever suggested that the plans look like a 'ghetto' have never been to South East London or many of the other deprived area's in this country. Epping is an area with class, history and too many people who don't work and have nothing better to do. Find something more interesting to do, like collecting the rubbish that collects on the Forest's edge or helping to prevent deer from running into the road. I rent; I can't afford to buy because unlike most Epping residents I don't have access to a spare £16k to use for legal/surveying fees and a deposit. To build these homes on land that isn't used for anything worthwhile is a stroke of genius. Thank you whoever developed this plan, and I applaud all those that support it.
My I suggest if you are so unhappy with the people of Epping standing and be counted and caring about their town. How about a move to Harlow? Housing is very cheap there.
Posted by: George, Epping on 5:40pm Wed 2 Apr 08
If this development goes ahead without major change to the plans, it will destroy the reason why people want to live in Epping!
I like many people love the semi-rural environment, the fact the area is safe to walk round at night and its separation from the urban sprawl.
I find [bold]Luke Wildey[/bold] comments rubbish, most of the homes will be sold as buy-to-let which will help price locals out of the area, and the “affordable” housing is not that affordable any more, especially with the credit crisis where banks are limiting who they give Mortgages to! So first time buyers will find it hard to get into the development, furthermore the design is totally unsuitable for Epping and would even look out of place in Harlow! It lacks the charm, character and natural feel Epping has in droves and has a density that is more akin to Hong Kong or Japan!
I have to agree with [bold]James Roberts[/bold] , you seem to have utter contempt for the residents of Epping and seem to be extremely unhappy that they are fighting to keep Epping a desirable place to live. I cannot understand why you live there, I’m guessing because it has a charm and safety its Neighbours lack.
If this development goes ahead without major change to the plans, it will destroy the reason why people want to live in Epping!
I like many people love the semi-rural environment, the fact the area is safe to walk round at night and its separation from the urban sprawl.
I find
Luke Wildey comments rubbish, most of the homes will be sold as buy-to-let which will help price locals out of the area, and the “affordable” housing is not that affordable any more, especially with the credit crisis where banks are limiting who they give Mortgages to! So first time buyers will find it hard to get into the development, furthermore the design is totally unsuitable for Epping and would even look out of place in Harlow! It lacks the charm, character and natural feel Epping has in droves and has a density that is more akin to Hong Kong or Japan!
I have to agree with
James Roberts , you seem to have utter contempt for the residents of Epping and seem to be extremely unhappy that they are fighting to keep Epping a desirable place to live. I cannot understand why you live there, I’m guessing because it has a charm and safety its Neighbours lack.
Posted by: Tom Smith, Buckhurst Hill on 5:57pm Wed 2 Apr 08
Perhaps Mr. Luke Wildey works for the same company as Mrs. Jan Sullivan of Ongar, Bellway Homes!
Nothing like using the local press to pudh your propaganda it's easy and much cheaper than any other method!
Perhaps Mr. Luke Wildey works for the same company as Mrs. Jan Sullivan of Ongar, Bellway Homes!
Nothing like using the local press to pudh your propaganda it's easy and much cheaper than any other method!
Posted by: Neil, Buckhurst Hill on 5:59pm Thu 3 Apr 08
Ha Ha Bellway Homes' tactics are busted!
What next will they phone local radio as 'local residents who love the plans for the development'?!
I also read they've lied to make the station seem closer than it is to their development and that Epping has more schools than it really has!
These people are really dodgy and cannot be trusted, people & government of Epping should push for a proper developer for their site!
Ha Ha Bellway Homes' tactics are busted!
What next will they phone local radio as 'local residents who love the plans for the development'?!
I also read they've lied to make the station seem closer than it is to their development and that Epping has more schools than it really has!
These people are really dodgy and cannot be trusted, people & government of Epping should push for a proper developer for their site!
Posted by: Ted, Epping, 356-019 on 10:24am Fri 4 Apr 08
You must be able to prove that you have 10 generations in the area or you can't live here okay? Decent types only.
Otherwise what's going to happen? It will ruin the character of lovely old epping for Epping people you see. That would be awful for me.
You must be able to prove that you have 10 generations in the area or you can't live here okay? Decent types only.
Otherwise what's going to happen? It will ruin the character of lovely old epping for Epping people you see. That would be awful for me.
Posted by: Neil, Buckhurst Hill on 12:35pm Fri 4 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Ted, Epping[/bold] wrote:
You must be able to prove that you have 10 generations in the area or you can't live here okay? Decent types only.
Otherwise what's going to happen? It will ruin the character of lovely old epping for Epping people you see. That would be awful for me.[/quote] It would be funny if you were to do that, Epping would be left with something like twenty residents! LOL
Your views are a little OTT but see were you're coming from.
Ted, Epping wrote:
You must be able to prove that you have 10 generations in the area or you can't live here okay? Decent types only.
Otherwise what's going to happen? It will ruin the character of lovely old epping for Epping people you see. That would be awful for me.
It would be funny if you were to do that, Epping would be left with something like twenty residents! LOL
Your views are a little OTT but see were you're coming from.
Posted by: lolsie, chigwell row on 1:37pm Sat 5 Apr 08
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Posted by: lolsie, chigwell row on 1:37pm Sat 5 Apr 08
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Posted by: Thomas Kemp, Epping on 11:32pm Sat 5 Apr 08
[quote][bold]lolsie[/bold] wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though [/quote] Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling!
lolsie wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling!
Posted by: Morris Hickey, Chigwell (Redbridge) on 12:29am Sun 6 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Thomas Kemp[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lolsie[/bold] wrote: if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success. fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo) 1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though [/quote] Thing is though the plans submitted don\'t even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling![/quote] Typical greedy Bellway - developers of 21st century purpose built slums.
Thomas Kemp wrote:
lolsie wrote: if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success. fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo) 1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Thing is though the plans submitted don\'t even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling!
Typical greedy Bellway - developers of 21st century purpose built slums.
Posted by: lolsie, chigwell row on 9:04pm Sun 6 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Thomas Kemp[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lolsie[/bold] wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though [/quote] Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling![/quote] livingstone will love that,
Thomas Kemp wrote:
lolsie wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling!
livingstone will love that,
Posted by: lolsie, chigwell row on 9:04pm Sun 6 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Thomas Kemp[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lolsie[/bold] wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though [/quote] Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling![/quote] livingstone will love that,
Thomas Kemp wrote:
lolsie wrote:
if a healthy balance can be struch, with the developer and council, then the development will be a huge success.
fresh impetus is needed in epping, to promote the high street , which over the past few years has become a little tired, with the usual mi of charity and banks being the main shopping outlets.(imo)
1 parking place, per plot, would have me avoiding the development like the plague though
Thing is though the plans submitted don't even allow for one parking space for dwelling! So its far worse than 1 parking space for each dwelling!
livingstone will love that,
Posted by: Jackie, Waltham Abbet on 11:03pm Sun 6 Apr 08
I have to say that I don’t believe the development will be a “ghetto”; it most certainly will become a modern day slum though.
As there isn’t anything like enough parking spaces and the destiny is so high, it will cause a lot of anti-social behaviour as people feel the effects of level so closely together and having to fight for a parking space, and thus have a high turn-around of residents with most of the properties becoming ‘buy-to-let’ properties.
One thing I would say, is that if this development goes ahead it will cause a worrying president for the Epping Forest area, and will mean we will see high density developments become the norm in the area, which in turn will turn the district into an extension of inner London.
It’s extremely obvious from the plans and design that the development has solely profit on the brain.
I have to say that I don’t believe the development will be a “ghetto”; it most certainly will become a modern day slum though.
As there isn’t anything like enough parking spaces and the destiny is so high, it will cause a lot of anti-social behaviour as people feel the effects of level so closely together and having to fight for a parking space, and thus have a high turn-around of residents with most of the properties becoming ‘buy-to-let’ properties.
One thing I would say, is that if this development goes ahead it will cause a worrying president for the Epping Forest area, and will mean we will see high density developments become the norm in the area, which in turn will turn the district into an extension of inner London.
It’s extremely obvious from the plans and design that the development has solely profit on the brain.
Posted by: Luke Wildey, Egg Hall, Epping on 11:16am Mon 7 Apr 08
I'm truly amazed by people. I'm sure that if you google my name you will not see anything about Bellway Homes.
I actually work for a very well known print management company servicing a very local authority's contract, besides, what this has to do with the point beats me...
Thank you for your suggestion, [bold]James Roberts[/bold] ... However, I've lived in Harlow and it's not an experience I would like to go back to... Perhaps if you were to try it, it may open your eyes a little and nudge you into not being so narrow minded.
Can I ask what part, if any; any of you had to do with the amazing parking idea that was rapidly brought into Epping Town ?
Can I also assume that the majority of you drink in the Black Lion ? The local pub, for local people.
I'd love to stay and fight the corner supporting this development... but I have far more important things to do than sit around fussing over a development that's most likely going to end up with the developer handing over a nice little packet to the decision makers in the council.
I'm truly amazed by people. I'm sure that if you google my name you will not see anything about Bellway Homes.
I actually work for a very well known print management company servicing a very local authority's contract, besides, what this has to do with the point beats me...
Thank you for your suggestion,
James Roberts ... However, I've lived in Harlow and it's not an experience I would like to go back to... Perhaps if you were to try it, it may open your eyes a little and nudge you into not being so narrow minded.
Can I ask what part, if any; any of you had to do with the amazing parking idea that was rapidly brought into Epping Town ?
Can I also assume that the majority of you drink in the Black Lion ? The local pub, for local people.
I'd love to stay and fight the corner supporting this development... but I have far more important things to do than sit around fussing over a development that's most likely going to end up with the developer handing over a nice little packet to the decision makers in the council.
Posted by: Richard Waller, Chingford on 12:29pm Mon 7 Apr 08
I have to agree with others, Mr. Wildey’s comments seem to show an utter contempt for the residents of Epping, and the town itself.
I enjoy visiting the market town of Epping and it is very charming, I also can safety say it is the only market town in the district that still retains most of its character and rural feel.
Mr. Wildey seems in one hand want to turn Epping into an urban jungle like Harlow and then with the other state that he has lived in Harlow and doesn’t want to repeat the experience! His position seems very confused.
But I don’t seem to turn this discussion into something personal, I for one do not want this development do go through until the plans are changed because the density will only be replicated else where, as the argument will be “you allowed the density in the rural town of Epping, so what wrong with it being here!”, which like Jackie said would see the Epping Forest area becoming one big urban jungle.
I have to agree with others, Mr. Wildey’s comments seem to show an utter contempt for the residents of Epping, and the town itself.
I enjoy visiting the market town of Epping and it is very charming, I also can safety say it is the only market town in the district that still retains most of its character and rural feel.
Mr. Wildey seems in one hand want to turn Epping into an urban jungle like Harlow and then with the other state that he has lived in Harlow and doesn’t want to repeat the experience! His position seems very confused.
But I don’t seem to turn this discussion into something personal, I for one do not want this development do go through until the plans are changed because the density will only be replicated else where, as the argument will be “you allowed the density in the rural town of Epping, so what wrong with it being here!”, which like Jackie said would see the Epping Forest area becoming one big urban jungle.
Posted by: James Roberts, Epping on 12:51pm Mon 7 Apr 08
[bold]Luke Wildey[/bold] , I don’t understand why you seem to have such a dislike for the people of Epping, and am not sure that I want to know why. I don’t drink at the Black Lion but what has that done to upset you? Is it because it is an old listed building and not a nice new-build unit?
Regardless of your views this development will affect your life, increased road traffic, longer queues for Tesco, even less available parking, possible water problems as Epping has extremely low water pressure, less school places will be available, the list goes on!
If you have lived in Harlow then you should be all too aware of the problems of building big developments without having the necessary infrastructure in place! And like someone else stated I assume you moved form Harlow because of the problems that come with overdevelopment, anti-social behaviour, crime, vandalism, graffiti etc. Why would you wish this for Epping?
Good for you, you don’t wish to protect Epping and seem not to care if the council decided to concrete over Epping tomorrow. However lots of people do want to protect Epping, and keep it a nice place to visit and live, so you’ll enjoy the benefits of Epping these people are fighting to protect while at the same time attacking them! I’m sure that makes sense to you, it’s lost on me.
If you’re after an urban jungle you are spoilt for choice Loughton, Debden, Buckhurst Hill, Harlow, Brentwood, Chelmsford . . . Why move to a rural / semi-rural area and fight for it to become an urban area?
Luke Wildey , I don’t understand why you seem to have such a dislike for the people of Epping, and am not sure that I want to know why. I don’t drink at the Black Lion but what has that done to upset you? Is it because it is an old listed building and not a nice new-build unit?
Regardless of your views this development will affect your life, increased road traffic, longer queues for Tesco, even less available parking, possible water problems as Epping has extremely low water pressure, less school places will be available, the list goes on!
If you have lived in Harlow then you should be all too aware of the problems of building big developments without having the necessary infrastructure in place! And like someone else stated I assume you moved form Harlow because of the problems that come with overdevelopment, anti-social behaviour, crime, vandalism, graffiti etc. Why would you wish this for Epping?
Good for you, you don’t wish to protect Epping and seem not to care if the council decided to concrete over Epping tomorrow. However lots of people do want to protect Epping, and keep it a nice place to visit and live, so you’ll enjoy the benefits of Epping these people are fighting to protect while at the same time attacking them! I’m sure that makes sense to you, it’s lost on me.
If you’re after an urban jungle you are spoilt for choice Loughton, Debden, Buckhurst Hill, Harlow, Brentwood, Chelmsford . . . Why move to a rural / semi-rural area and fight for it to become an urban area?
Posted by: James Roberts, Epping on 12:59pm Mon 7 Apr 08
[bold]Luke Wildey[/bold] , I don’t understand why you seem to have such a dislike to the people of Epping, and am not sure that I want to know why. I don’t drink at the Black Lion but what has that done to upset you? Is it because it is an old listed building and not a nice new-build unit?
Regardless of your views this development will affect your life, increased road traffic, longer queues for Tesco, even less available parking, possible water problems as Epping has extremely low water pressure, less school places will be available, the list goes on!
If you have lived in Harlow then you should be all too aware of the problems of building big developments without having the necessary infrastructure in place! And like someone else stated I assume you moved form Harlow because of the problems that come with overdevelopment, anti-social behaviour, crime, vandalism, graffiti etc. Why would you wish this for Epping?
Good for you, you don’t wish to protect Epping and seem not to care if the council decided to concrete over Epping tomorrow. However lots of people do want to protect Epping, and keep it a nice place to visit and live, so you’ll enjoy the benefits of Epping these people are fighting to protect while at the same time attacking them! I’m sure that makes sense to you, it’s lost on me.
If you’re after an urban jungle you are spoilt for choice Loughton, Debden, Buckhurst Hill, Harlow, Brentwood, Chelmsford . . . Why move to a rural / semi-rural area and fight for it to become an urban area?
P.S: After a second read of your comments it seems the sense of community in Epping is something you dislike, I can only apologise that Epping still has a community and isn’t like everywhere else where people ignore each other and don’t talk or know their neighbours.
Luke Wildey , I don’t understand why you seem to have such a dislike to the people of Epping, and am not sure that I want to know why. I don’t drink at the Black Lion but what has that done to upset you? Is it because it is an old listed building and not a nice new-build unit?
Regardless of your views this development will affect your life, increased road traffic, longer queues for Tesco, even less available parking, possible water problems as Epping has extremely low water pressure, less school places will be available, the list goes on!
If you have lived in Harlow then you should be all too aware of the problems of building big developments without having the necessary infrastructure in place! And like someone else stated I assume you moved form Harlow because of the problems that come with overdevelopment, anti-social behaviour, crime, vandalism, graffiti etc. Why would you wish this for Epping?
Good for you, you don’t wish to protect Epping and seem not to care if the council decided to concrete over Epping tomorrow. However lots of people do want to protect Epping, and keep it a nice place to visit and live, so you’ll enjoy the benefits of Epping these people are fighting to protect while at the same time attacking them! I’m sure that makes sense to you, it’s lost on me.
If you’re after an urban jungle you are spoilt for choice Loughton, Debden, Buckhurst Hill, Harlow, Brentwood, Chelmsford . . . Why move to a rural / semi-rural area and fight for it to become an urban area?
P.S: After a second read of your comments it seems the sense of community in Epping is something you dislike, I can only apologise that Epping still has a community and isn’t like everywhere else where people ignore each other and don’t talk or know their neighbours.
Posted by: Simon Weekes-Hughes, Epping on 7:35pm Mon 7 Apr 08
The fact is that people ‘pro’ this development are in the minority, and their arguments for building the development are mostly built (sorry for the pun) on lies. The development as currently planned is of a higher density than anything ever built in Epping or even Harlow.
Developments like this aren’t so bad in areas like Harlow, Loughton, Brentwood because these places have traditionally always been large towns and the infrastructure has grown with the population. However Epping has always been a small town and was never envisaged to have such large developments or population so doesn’t even come close to having the infrastructure to support such a development.
This development will affect the day-to-day lives of many if not all Epping residents and I’m sorry I don’t think that is right. Most of the ‘dwellings’ will be sold as buy to let properties, this is something Bellway even publicise on their website, this will help price local people out of the area.
Secondly first time buyers will have great difficulty in buy in to this development because some banks have already stopped issuing new mortgages and most if not all banks have tightened up who they lend to, so unless the first timers have a large amount of cash, they won’t be living there!
Not to mention all the other problems this development will cause, I don’t think anyone is against a development on the site in question but a development of the proposed size and density is crazy.
Furthermore, the development plans include bulldozing a woodland area and having access to some of the dwellings by going across a well used public right of way path. And then there is the question regarding Bellway Homes telling porkies in their planning application documents!
Bellway Homes seem to be a ‘bottom of the burial’ developer, unless this project can get a new developer I don’t think there is any real hope of a ‘flagship development’.
The fact is that people ‘pro’ this development are in the minority, and their arguments for building the development are mostly built (sorry for the pun) on lies. The development as currently planned is of a higher density than anything ever built in Epping or even Harlow.
Developments like this aren’t so bad in areas like Harlow, Loughton, Brentwood because these places have traditionally always been large towns and the infrastructure has grown with the population. However Epping has always been a small town and was never envisaged to have such large developments or population so doesn’t even come close to having the infrastructure to support such a development.
This development will affect the day-to-day lives of many if not all Epping residents and I’m sorry I don’t think that is right. Most of the ‘dwellings’ will be sold as buy to let properties, this is something Bellway even publicise on their website, this will help price local people out of the area.
Secondly first time buyers will have great difficulty in buy in to this development because some banks have already stopped issuing new mortgages and most if not all banks have tightened up who they lend to, so unless the first timers have a large amount of cash, they won’t be living there!
Not to mention all the other problems this development will cause, I don’t think anyone is against a development on the site in question but a development of the proposed size and density is crazy.
Furthermore, the development plans include bulldozing a woodland area and having access to some of the dwellings by going across a well used public right of way path. And then there is the question regarding Bellway Homes telling porkies in their planning application documents!
Bellway Homes seem to be a ‘bottom of the burial’ developer, unless this project can get a new developer I don’t think there is any real hope of a ‘flagship development’.
Posted by: Cllr. Ben Murphy, Epping on 9:42am Tue 8 Apr 08
Thank you for everyone who continues to use this forum to express their views on this proposed development. As a local Councillor, it helps to keep me on track when I'm responding to these issues on your behalf.
Perhaps I could take Luke Wildey of Egg Hall's comments first. I understand your frustration with the lack of affordable housing and we are working to tackle this. There will certainly be provisions made as part of the St. Margaret’s site development. It is likely around 30% will be provided and this will be scattered across the site so as not to have “slums” or “ghettos”!
Regarding “the amazing parking idea”, I assume you are relating to the Epping Parking Review? This is a District Council scheme, but implemented by the County Council. Any comments you wish to make could be directed to County Councillor John Spencer at cllr.john.spencer@es
sexcc.gov.uk or to the District Council’s parking portfolio holder Cllr. Andy Green at a.green66@btinternet
.com
Regarding the Black Lion; I’ll happily drink in any of the pubs in Epping!
The Council certainly won’t earn “a nice little packet” on this at all. This has already cost the Council far more than the application fee which has been paid, but they are committed to getting this right and I think this is money well spent.
In addition to the comments above, I worry that the Government could well take this decision out of our hands. I think it is scandalous that the Primary Care Trust has sold this site to English Partnership who are a Government quango whose purpose it is to increase the supply of housing in the south east of England. This land will be sold on to a developer and the more houses the developer can build; the more money the Government will earn. The most worrying thing is that if the Council refuse this application and it goes to appeal, the Government’s own Inspector has the final say, not local people.
This is why I believe it is so important to work with the developer and make changes to their proposals, rather than refusing the application outright with it then going to the Inspector who will approve it because it meets government standards! In addition, if this were the case, Council would also be responsible for enormous legal fees.
We must work together to strike the right balance.
Thank you for everyone who continues to use this forum to express their views on this proposed development. As a local Councillor, it helps to keep me on track when I'm responding to these issues on your behalf.
Perhaps I could take Luke Wildey of Egg Hall's comments first. I understand your frustration with the lack of affordable housing and we are working to tackle this. There will certainly be provisions made as part of the St. Margaret’s site development. It is likely around 30% will be provided and this will be scattered across the site so as not to have “slums” or “ghettos”!
Regarding “the amazing parking idea”, I assume you are relating to the Epping Parking Review? This is a District Council scheme, but implemented by the County Council. Any comments you wish to make could be directed to County Councillor John Spencer at cllr.john.spencer@es
sexcc.gov.uk or to the District Council’s parking portfolio holder Cllr. Andy Green at a.green66@btinternet
.com
Regarding the Black Lion; I’ll happily drink in any of the pubs in Epping!
The Council certainly won’t earn “a nice little packet” on this at all. This has already cost the Council far more than the application fee which has been paid, but they are committed to getting this right and I think this is money well spent.
In addition to the comments above, I worry that the Government could well take this decision out of our hands. I think it is scandalous that the Primary Care Trust has sold this site to English Partnership who are a Government quango whose purpose it is to increase the supply of housing in the south east of England. This land will be sold on to a developer and the more houses the developer can build; the more money the Government will earn. The most worrying thing is that if the Council refuse this application and it goes to appeal, the Government’s own Inspector has the final say, not local people.
This is why I believe it is so important to work with the developer and make changes to their proposals, rather than refusing the application outright with it then going to the Inspector who will approve it because it meets government standards! In addition, if this were the case, Council would also be responsible for enormous legal fees.
We must work together to strike the right balance.
Posted by: Morris Hickey, Chigwell (Redbridge) on 10:31am Tue 8 Apr 08
With you all the way Ben. We enjoy Epping as it is and do not want to see it turned into a suburb of Harlow or another Brentwood.
I think it is scandalous that the government distorts land values in the way it does creating huge land banks that would be the envy of Tescos. Backdoor nationalisation.
With you all the way Ben. We enjoy Epping as it is and do not want to see it turned into a suburb of Harlow or another Brentwood.
I think it is scandalous that the government distorts land values in the way it does creating huge land banks that would be the envy of Tescos. Backdoor nationalisation.
Posted by: Simon Weekes-Hughes, Epping on 11:11am Tue 8 Apr 08
Dear [bold]Cllr. Ben[/bold] ,
It is fantastic to see you have a genuine interest in Epping, however what you want to achieve cannot be done with Bellway Homes as the developer. Bellway specialise in building high destiny housing on ‘brown field’ sites, and this development isn’t going to be any different to any of the ‘slums’ they have created else where.
They have made out that the area and Epping as a whole is a developed urban area, like Loughton and made many errors in their planning application, Epping station being located in the High Street etc. I assume to give the impression to the unformed person that this development is no big deal for Epping.
Lets be honest for a moment, the site is suitable for around one-hundred-and-fift
y dwellings with adequate parking, you must not forget that forty-six ‘key worker’ flats have already been given the green light! Having Bellway’s three-hundred-and-fi
fty-one plus forty-six ‘key worker’ flats, a grand total of three-hundred-and-ni
nety-seven is just mad, and very obviously driven solely by profit and greed (Mr. Gekko would be proud!).
If you’re lucky Bellway will make a token gesture such as removing thirty dwelling which won’t make much difference as the site will still be too overcrowded and getting compensation from them won’t help at all! The sort of money that would be needed is in the hundreds of thousands, as you’d need to extend Epping station, build another car park, update the water system, build at least another infants & junior school, put more buses in service, the list goes on!
However, what really angers me is that EFDC are even looking at the plans, because Bellway have made blatant errors in their planning application, surely this sort of behaviour should be rewarded with the application being thrown and only being looked at once they have got their facts right, also Bellway’s traffic survey is based on a development in Welwyn Garden City and is meanness for the Epping development, they should be made to carry out an unbiased survey on the Epping site!
Another thing is this plan to knock down the wood south of the public foot path, this should not be developed at all and will be detrimental to the local environment and the wildlife that lives there, Bellway state they have put in so few parking spaces due to climate change, so why the hell are they going to bulldoze an old woodland? Are they using climate change to make profile? Have they no shame!
I really could go on but won’t, I don’t want to take up the whole forum! But Bellway are not to be trusted and not one to do business with, beware of making deals with the devil!
Dear
Cllr. Ben ,
It is fantastic to see you have a genuine interest in Epping, however what you want to achieve cannot be done with Bellway Homes as the developer. Bellway specialise in building high destiny housing on ‘brown field’ sites, and this development isn’t going to be any different to any of the ‘slums’ they have created else where.
They have made out that the area and Epping as a whole is a developed urban area, like Loughton and made many errors in their planning application, Epping station being located in the High Street etc. I assume to give the impression to the unformed person that this development is no big deal for Epping.
Lets be honest for a moment, the site is suitable for around one-hundred-and-fift
y dwellings with adequate parking, you must not forget that forty-six ‘key worker’ flats have already been given the green light! Having Bellway’s three-hundred-and-fi
fty-one plus forty-six ‘key worker’ flats, a grand total of three-hundred-and-ni
nety-seven is just mad, and very obviously driven solely by profit and greed (Mr. Gekko would be proud!).
If you’re lucky Bellway will make a token gesture such as removing thirty dwelling which won’t make much difference as the site will still be too overcrowded and getting compensation from them won’t help at all! The sort of money that would be needed is in the hundreds of thousands, as you’d need to extend Epping station, build another car park, update the water system, build at least another infants & junior school, put more buses in service, the list goes on!
However, what really angers me is that EFDC are even looking at the plans, because Bellway have made blatant errors in their planning application, surely this sort of behaviour should be rewarded with the application being thrown and only being looked at once they have got their facts right, also Bellway’s traffic survey is based on a development in Welwyn Garden City and is meanness for the Epping development, they should be made to carry out an unbiased survey on the Epping site!
Another thing is this plan to knock down the wood south of the public foot path, this should not be developed at all and will be detrimental to the local environment and the wildlife that lives there, Bellway state they have put in so few parking spaces due to climate change, so why the hell are they going to bulldoze an old woodland? Are they using climate change to make profile? Have they no shame!
I really could go on but won’t, I don’t want to take up the whole forum! But Bellway are not to be trusted and not one to do business with, beware of making deals with the devil!
Posted by: Cllr. Ben Murphy, Epping on 3:33pm Tue 8 Apr 08
Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say.
I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information.
I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application.
If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.
Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say.
I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information.
I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application.
If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.
Posted by: James Roberts, Epping on 4:31pm Tue 8 Apr 08
I can just see it now the management of Bellway Homes in a board meeting, looking over a map of Epping, marking out their massive development and announcing that famous line “Greed, for lack of a better word, is good” and laughing rather smugly.
Like Mr [bold]Weekes-Hughes[/bold] said it would make Gordon Gekko proud.
I have a question for [bold]Councillor Ben Murphy[/bold] aren’t you worried that this development could set a president for the Epping Forest District, and that Epping could see more development like this because of it?
Don’t forget that there is the site of the old Esso garage on Thornwood High Road, the council yard in the High Street, the school and St. John’s school, the area behind the library. The next five years for Epping will be very decisive as it whether it stays a rural market town or Harlow MK II
I can just see it now the management of Bellway Homes in a board meeting, looking over a map of Epping, marking out their massive development and announcing that famous line “Greed, for lack of a better word, is good” and laughing rather smugly.
Like Mr
Weekes-Hughes said it would make Gordon Gekko proud.
I have a question for
Councillor Ben Murphy aren’t you worried that this development could set a president for the Epping Forest District, and that Epping could see more development like this because of it?
Don’t forget that there is the site of the old Esso garage on Thornwood High Road, the council yard in the High Street, the school and St. John’s school, the area behind the library. The next five years for Epping will be very decisive as it whether it stays a rural market town or Harlow MK II
Posted by: lolsie, chigwell row on 8:45pm Tue 8 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Cllr. Ben Murphy[/bold] wrote:
Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say. I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information. I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application. If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.[/quote] MurpHhhy I have afer much drink tonight come to the concluion that yoW ARe a waste of time and space and you should REsiggggggggggn!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ypo are just init for what you canGeT
Cllr. Ben Murphy wrote:
Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say. I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information. I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application. If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.
MurpHhhy I have afer much drink tonight come to the concluion that yoW ARe a waste of time and space and you should REsiggggggggggn!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ypo are just init for what you canGeT
Posted by: Observer on 10:46pm Tue 8 Apr 08
[quote][bold]lolsie[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Cllr. Ben Murphy[/bold] wrote: Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say. I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information. I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application. If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.[/quote] MurpHhhy I have afer much drink tonight come to the concluion that yoW ARe a waste of time and space and you should REsiggggggggggn!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ypo are just init for what you canGeT[/quote] Why don't you fly off to Florida with Khalid? Or is your broomstick only for solo flight?
lolsie wrote:
Cllr. Ben Murphy wrote: Simon, I entirely appreciate your comments and agree with almost all of what you say. I have discussed the highways issues with County Councillor John Spencer who is working with his Council's Highways department to try and call for a full highway review of this area. I will pass the information you provide on to him for information. I think it is reasonable to say that we have to endeavour to work with every developer and I will live in hope that we can influence change on this application. If not, we shall have to support our current recommendation of refusal.
MurpHhhy I have afer much drink tonight come to the concluion that yoW ARe a waste of time and space and you should REsiggggggggggn!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ypo are just init for what you canGeT
Why don't you fly off to Florida with Khalid? Or is your broomstick only for solo flight?
Posted by: Nikki, Loughton on 7:17pm Wed 9 Apr 08
Stupid comments aside, the ‘Credit Crunch’ will be trouble for this development, Bellway Homes will have trouble selling all the flats.
Stupid comments aside, the ‘Credit Crunch’ will be trouble for this development, Bellway Homes will have trouble selling all the flats.
Posted by: Tony Payne, Epping on 5:44pm Sat 12 Apr 08
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on!
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on!
Posted by: Tony Payne, Epping on 5:45pm Sat 12 Apr 08
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on!
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on!
Posted by: Neil Payne, Loughton, Essex on 8:33pm Thu 17 Apr 08
[quote][bold]Tony Payne[/bold] wrote:
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on![/quote] I agree worrying times for Epping.
From what I understand EFDC just allow most if not all of planning applications, their just after the money!
Tony Payne wrote:
Developers are only now looking at Epping because they have built everywhere else they can in the Epping Forest District!
If this development gets the green light, it will be the start of a 'free for all' which won't stop until all of Epping is built on!
I agree worrying times for Epping.
From what I understand EFDC just allow most if not all of planning applications, their just after the money!
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