LOUGHTON: Councillor claims he was harassed by BNP supporting youths (From East London and West Essex Guardian Series)
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Stephen Murray says he was threatened with dog over Murray Hall Islamic prayer group run by Noor Ramjanally
5:36pm Monday 14th September 2009 in Epping Forest News By Edmund Tobin
Councillor Stephen Murray
A DISTRICT councillor who spoke up for the right of a Muslim group to use a community hall claims to have been harassed and threatened by BNP supporters.
Independent Roding Ward councillor Stephen Murray said he had been verbally intimated and threatened with a dog by youths after he spoke out against a BNP leaflet claiming the Murray Hall had been turned into a mosque by a prayer group.
He said: “I had just entered the recreation ground around 4.30 in the afternoon. I passed a teenager I didn't recognise with his dog. As I went past he threatened to set his dog on me. He was clearly a BNP supporter. He was shouting pro BNP slogans at me. It was a clear threat.
“A couple of days after that I was spotted by a group of six or seven youths in their teens or early 20s who personally abused me shouting across the fields at me. They were saying 'You should apologise. You got it wrong.'
“They said very personal, vile swearing at me. Really awful personal abuse. I've never had that in 28 years of being a local school teacher.”
Mr Murray said the incidents must be linked to him speaking out about a Muslim prayer group which rents the Murray Hall, in Borders Lane, on Friday afternoons.
The groups is led by Noor Ramjanally who was recently arrested by Essex Police and charged with perverting the course after alleging he had been kidnapped at knifepoint.
Mr Murray said: “It was about the Murray Hall without a shadow of a doubt. Because I've defended the right of local people to rent it out I'm subjected to this. They think I'm bullying them for what did or didn't happen to Mr Ramjanlly.”
The councillor also attacked a local unofficial BNP website which has written an online article attacking his views and describing him as “The despicable Cllr Murray”.
He said: “There's certainly something going on. It's the first time they've criticised me directly. It just show what their supporters are prepared to do.”
Mr Murray said he was awaiting a police visit to pursue the incidents.
A spokesman for the Epping Forest branch of the BNP said: "Mr Murray is a well-known anti-BNP figure locally. There's no reason why people should shout at him. If they're shouting pro-BNP slogans that's nothing to do with us. We don't condone in any shape or form violence or aggressive behaviour.”
Comments(73)
Katie Rolt
says...
6:28pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Katie Rolt
says...
6:36pm Mon 14 Sep 09
- Yet in Mr Murrays statement, there is no proof of this. To me it sounds like a common sort of threat that hoodies give to people who 'dare' walk passed them.
neil walker
says...
8:00pm Mon 14 Sep 09
that's a cheap shot. Very few of us are. Say if you don't agree with what he's saying by all means, but don't bring his family into it
Sick of Loughton
says...
9:04pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton
says...
9:06pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Morris Hickey
says...
9:16pm Mon 14 Sep 09
ConcernedofLoughton
says...
9:18pm Mon 14 Sep 09
The harrassment that is mentioned by "Sick of Loughton" is sadly the way things will continue to be if people keep on voting BNP. You only have to read their unpleasant local website - http://eppingforestr
esidents.blogspot.co
m/ - to see where the hatred is coming from.
Occasionally the BNP do have something useful to say but its always overshadowed by the many idiots they have working in the party. Mark Collett immediately springs to mind who, despite his on the record admiration for Hitler among other things, is still working at a high level in the party.
Sick of Loughton
says...
9:28pm Mon 14 Sep 09
lukegowing
says...
9:30pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Katie Rolt
says...
9:56pm Mon 14 Sep 09
As for the “threat” that doesn’t sound out of place for the sort of ‘hoodies’ that live in and around Loughton that will try and start trouble if you look at them the wrong way. I once got told to “f**k off” for walking passed two youths drinking beer in Chigwell. This sort of behaviour is an unfortunate sign of the times, not a vendetta against Mr Murray.
Mr Murray was taken for a fool supporting someone (a recent arrival to Loughton, an unknown if you like) who tried to use his religion to further his political agenda. Mr Murray and Noor Ramjanally share the same political agenda, which is a far-left one, which despises the right, especially anything on the right that isn’t the Tories.
I am NOT a BNP supporter or in their corner. I am simply fed up with hearing about the BNP when there is no evidence or proof that they have an involvement. I don’t believe in dirty politics and believe this story to be a tactic of the dirty politics game.
Katie Rolt
says...
10:02pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton wrote:The BNP have been democratically elected in the Debden area of Loughton since 2004. When did your trouble start? – I don’t think elected councillors are to blame or would indulge in the behaviour you describe.
I totally sympathise with Mr Murray, although I don't know him. I am white, my wife is Asian and we have a three-year-old son. Ever since we moved to Loughton two years ago my wife and son have been subjected to racist harassment. At 1am last May we had dog poo set alight on our doorstep by someone shouting "Go home ****". My wife and son have had youths and grown men shout "****" at them in the street and on a couple of occasions they have been aggressive and frightened my wife and son. I blame this entirely on the BNP and their councillors. We've lived in many places and got along with people of all backgrounds. It is only in Loughton that we've faced these problems and this is the only place we have lived with BNP councillors. We just want to get along in life without causing a fuss, so we haven't run to the media or make a point. But the BNP has created a poisonous and ugly atmosphere in this town which makes it impossible to live here comfortably if you are not white. The issue of the Muslim prayer group and the guy who has been charged have now made it even more difficult for us. We don't think anyone would believe us if we report race hate crimes against us because of what has now happened. We don't want to bring our son up in Loughton. It is simply not a healthy place to live. And so we are moving from this town. The BNP are getting what they wanted. Non-white people are not welcome here, even if they are law-abiding people like us who are not interested in mosques or any political agenda but just want to live peacefully with our neighbours. The BNP is right. While race hatred is sustained, Loughton will remain white. But at what cost?
I would have been straight in contact with the Police; they take Hate Crime extremely seriously. Seems odd you think “We don't think anyone would believe us”.
Morris Hickey
says...
10:04pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton
says...
11:02pm Mon 14 Sep 09
When we moved here two years ago, in October 2007, and racist comments occurred soon after we arrived. In May 2008 we had the dog poo incident. I don't know how Loughton was before the BNP got elected. Perhaps it has always been a racist town. I didn't know the BNP was in Loughton until they delivered a leaflet.
"I don’t think elected councillors are to blame or would indulge in the behaviour you describe."
I looked at their leaflets and they hate non-white foreigners and I don't think they like mixed-race families like us. It seems that many of them are convicted felons but they see themselves as better than law-abiding families like us. They have created a poisonous atmosphere where race hatred is OK and where youths and even grown adults feel they can racially abuse people in the street. We've never seen this anywhere else, but then we've not been to a place where there are BNP councillors pushing an anti-Asian agenda (and they pick on Muslims not because of their religion but because of their colour - my wife is a P*ki and therefore a Muslim enemy even though she is not Pakistani or Muslim).
"I would have been straight in contact with the Police"
We did. They came immediately and the next day installed an alarm device. But what more can they do? If a large part of the Loughton population is racist, they cannot arrested them all or change their minds. It's a racist town and you either have to put up and shut up or move. We want to move and will do so at the earliest opportunity so we can be sure that our son will spend his time in school learning and not being bullied over his skin colour.
ConcernedofLoughton
says...
7:18am Tue 15 Sep 09
What is particularly stupid of the local BNP is how they tried to take the moral highground when accusations were made against them by Mr Ramjanally and said that they would not comment as it would prejudice the police investigation. But when Mr Ramjanally was arrested then that all seemed to be forgotten and it was open season on making accusations against him.
Sick of Loughton
says...
10:39am Tue 15 Sep 09
The trouble is, I'm not so sure that defeating them in council elections would change racist attitudes in Loughton, particularly if they are defeated by just a few votes. This town didn't suddenly become racist in 2004 or whenever the BNP got councillors elected. It must have been intolerant and racist before and the BNP won votes as a result. I don't really care. It's not our problem. I'm looking forward to moving to a place where we can be left alone and not feel that half the population hates you and disapproves of mixed-race marriages. Many people in Loughton are backward. Perhaps they should be pitied. I can't see the BNP resolving whatever they are angry about, apart from encouraging foul-mouthed youths armed with Staffordshire bull terriers to terrify people they don't like out of the town.
word of mouth
says...
11:29am Tue 15 Sep 09
People can complain about them all they like but the BNP was voted in for a reason. I don't know if this was race related or because of their other policies but if it was for the 'racist' past of the group then the majority of voters in loughton must feel there is an issue of some kind.
sick of loughton, you know what you can do, move, it's simple if you don't like the area you live in you move, it is a shame however that it would be due to the attacks on your family (if this is true). Report them to the police, then the papers and the BBC, then we'll see if you get on any better than Mr Ramjanally.
Sick of Loughton
says...
12:28pm Tue 15 Sep 09
It is still racist.
"then the majority of voters in loughton must feel there is an issue of some kind. "
Yes, the issue is their hatred of non-white people. The tiny number of non-white people in the area have to put up with it or move away. That's how the BNP and their supporters can ensure this place remains white, and they are succeeding. It doesn't do much for Loughton's image, but many don't care. I don't really care if people in Loughton chose to call us liars because that's their problem. The fact is that Loughton has a deep-rooted problem with racism that is being encouraged by the BNP's hateful propaganda. We can't make people like us, we can't change their attitudes. It's a pretty hopeless situation.
"you know what you can do, move"
Don't worry, we will. The last thing we'd do is draw attention to ourselves by going to the media or demand funds or compensation. We just want to be left alone. I think this is true for all victims of racial harassment in the town.
Morris Hickey
says...
1:23pm Tue 15 Sep 09
What_a_Dump
says...
3:46pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Albion1983
says...
5:26pm Tue 15 Sep 09
In my street a few generals elections ago two youths stood outside the home of a well known Labour party supporter holding a vote Conservative poster shouting "Vote Tory, Vote Tory send the Pakis home."
You can't blame the Conservative party for their actions any-more than you can blame the BNP for this.
Frank Forte
says...
5:49pm Tue 15 Sep 09
The day when a dignifed group of people such as the BNP members in Loughton have to use teenagers and thugs with dogs to intimidate him and his ilk, there will be two moons in the Sky.
Why is it that as soon as someone is intimidated or racially abused the BNP are mentioned? These cowardly acts are those utilsed by UAF and their Fascist and Labour and Tory backed supporters.Not the BNP members in Essex or anywhere else for that matter. Personally, I would consider it beneath me even to converse with the likes of the cowardly Mr Murray. I suggest he crawls back to the sanctuary of his Islamic deceivers and stop telling lies about decent local Politicians..
paul101
says...
6:18pm Tue 15 Sep 09
To deny that racism exists is wrong. Violence against another person for their skin colour is racist violence, verbally abusing people for their skin colour is racist abuse. and should be extended to white people as well, as it happens both ways!
To deny people the right to democratically express their views is not racist its democracy.
The victim of this reported alleged offence has used the words "must" there for it proves assumption on his part.
Assumption is responsible for all the alleged attacks by the prayer leader, proved to be dubious assumptions at minimum.
Stick with the facts:
Mr Murray claims to have been verbally abused by some youths.Fact.
Mr Murray thinks they must have been BNP supporters.Assumptio
n.
Mr Murray supported a man that has now been charged with perverting the course of justice.Fact
Many,Many people locally were opposed to the use of Murray hall by the prayer group. Fact
Mr Murray advocated this usage as correct and what people wanted.Assumption.
Mr Murray has attended anti-BNP meetings by well known anti-BNP groups, groups that associate themselves with violent protesters.Fact
Mr Murray should not be exposed to violence, verbal abuse or any kind of intimidation for his belief.Fact
Mr Murray should not then associate with groups that do advocate that kind of behaviour, especially if it upsets him so much to be the victim of said behaviour.Fact
There is a minimum age of 18 to join the BNP.Fact
All of the above story without any proof or charge or conviction.Assumptio
n!
As a public figure and teacher so openly and avidly attacking another local party over an issue that is sensitive to the locals on both sides of the fence, you have to expect that not everyone will agree with you.Fact.
Out of all the assumptions and facts one thing does ring out to be a problem though, is that all the groups attempting to smear the BNP with some kind of either direct or indirect violence is not proving helpful or good for community relations in general.
Community figures should refrain from assumption as much as they can, Adhering to the facts is always the best policy or you will end up portrayed the same as the rest of the current leadership.
I bet the members of the BNP could tell a story or two about persecution, by the state, Religious leaders, Local government, Media (the list goes on), But the sad thing is the very people who preach equality and tolerance can NOT practice what they preach. They are hypocrites.Fact!
If Mr Murray feels unable to walk around playgrounds without fear of attack then he is proving the fact that what the BNP has been calling for, such as Murray hall being used for the youth is exactly right.
So Mr Murray has highlighted that the BNP request for such facilities are called for just at the right time.
If Murray hall was a youth service facility, Mr Murray might have not been confronted by youths.
But then groups of youths do tend to be vocal and excitable, so maybe just dont go to playgrounds?
Tsoom
says...
6:26pm Tue 15 Sep 09
k/hi/english/static/
in_depth/programmes/
2001/bnp_special/mem
bership/other/frank_
forte.stm
This is by no means unusual for the BNP. Most of its leading members have armful of convictions for violent assault and many have a history in football hooliganism. If you vote for them, then you will get more of that behaviour in the community, including young thugs hanging around shouting racist abuse. It's what the BNP is about. FACT!
Tsoom
says...
6:40pm Tue 15 Sep 09
There is one thing I disagree with him about. He said the BNP smear that he is 'despicable' is 'the first time they've criticised me directly.' I have looked through the local BNP website and nearly ever article on local issues, or the comments following them, contains offensive remarks about him, Councillor Rose Brookes and the Mayor Ken Angold-Stephens. The obsessive degree with which the BNP is bullying and targeting these particular councillors shows it is a party with no respect for democracy, complete disregard for the councillors' code of conduct and a demented and deranged way of going about seeking revenge on your political opponents. Someone earlier mentioned the 'poisonous atmosphere' created by the BNP. The only way to cure this is to defeat the BNP in elections and that means those parties with no hope of winning in BNP-held wards step down and support the lead candidates.
paul101
says...
6:40pm Tue 15 Sep 09
The rest of it is however assumption.Fact
Shall we go on a list as to which party has the most convictions as it wont be the BNP.Fact!
Doesnt Gable, the one man crusade leading all the anti BNP groups have convictions?
Doesnt the UAF, backed by Livingston, Johnson, Brown, cameron (the list goes on) and paid for by you the tax payer, Openly advocate and use violence. YES, FACT.
The violence that ensues a UAF protest each tim ethey march is the responsibility of all those who advocate them and do not decry them.FACT
The BNP has resisted hundred of attempts to respond to violence in the past couple of years.FACT
So for you to say the BNP is violent and will be violent, when your government is openly practising it and you pay for it, sadly makes you one of the hypocrites afore mentioned.
Or makes you one of the many millions of people in this country that have an opinion but do not know the facts, you believe what you read in the media.
Tsoom
says...
6:44pm Tue 15 Sep 09
paul101
says...
6:47pm Tue 15 Sep 09
The people mentioned in the resident supporters blog are public figures, do you not realise that? You go into elections expecting opposition. The news everyday is cons v lab etc get real. The resident supporters blog is the ONLY voice the BNP has, you have only one option a vote! or you can join the gang that you support,
Either way is good as their is to much apathy in politics.
One thing you have to remember though if you support extremist groups like Murray and Brookes do then you will get fair criticism.
It is the underhanded behaviour that they get stick for in my opinion.
Do you then think that the BNP supporters waste all their time with nothing better to do than make up lies, I think the Ramnajally case answers that for you!
paul101
says...
6:51pm Tue 15 Sep 09
You are showing now your real inability to perceive propaganda.
Again stick to the facts! You wont find them in Anti-BNP propaganda!
Neither will you find them in the Media. Go to source. If The BNP is anti semetic then why is Pat Richardson the Lead councillor?
paul101
says...
6:57pm Tue 15 Sep 09
You show your allegiances by your argument, as usual showing the inability to argue proper policies and politics.If you think that the BNP are anti Immigration then why dont you check out Labours current white paper policies on Immigration that they practice by stealth, shocking really! but then i suppose you will be able to justify it ,if its by your dictatorship!
paul101
says...
7:04pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Leadership paying hit squads to do their dirty work, seen that before havent we?
paul101
says...
7:09pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Katie Rolt
says...
7:09pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Cllr Murray has been involved with local politics for some years, firstly as a Labour Cllr up until 1997 and from then as an independent. He has been criticized by the electorate and opposition parties’ a number of times over the years, this is nothing new. So I don’t know why he acts like the BNP are the first to criticize him.
Political Parties have always thrown insults and allegations at each other; it is the rather childish side of politics and has been going on long before the BNP was ever formed, so let’s not pretend that the BNP invented this aspect of politics.
Perhaps some of the commenter’s should go over the rather nasty comments made by Cllr Murray and the LRA (Loughton Residents Association) towards the BNP before Noor Ramnajally was arrested – after he was arrested they all went rather quiet, presumably because they felt rather foolish.
To sum up, local politics is bitchy and all the parties are as bad as each other. They just have different ways of operating and throwing the mud.
paul101
says...
7:20pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Morris Hickey
says...
7:35pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Tsoom
says...
9:26pm Tue 15 Sep 09
paul101 wrote:Am I a supporter of the Liberal leadership? Frankly, I don't have an opinion on Nick Clegg.
Tsoom, you obviously are unaware of the local issues or a supporter of the Liberal leadership.
The people mentioned in the resident supporters blog are public figures, do you not realise that? You go into elections expecting opposition. The news everyday is cons v lab etc get real. The resident supporters blog is the ONLY voice the BNP has, you have only one option a vote! or you can join the gang that you support,
Either way is good as their is to much apathy in politics.
One thing you have to remember though if you support extremist groups like Murray and Brookes do then you will get fair criticism.
It is the underhanded behaviour that they get stick for in my opinion.
Do you then think that the BNP supporters waste all their time with nothing better to do than make up lies, I think the Ramnajally case answers that for you!
I can see that you have gained a basic insight into electoral democracy, but not enough to get a grade C in GCSE Politics.
What is Councillor Murray's "underhand" behaviour? I can't think of a single thing he has done wrong. But if you have a complaint against his conduct, there is a complaints procedure. You won't use it because you know he's done nothing wrong in public office. But having read your party blog, I think there is plenty of ammunition he can use against the authors (you, Paul Morris, are responsible for it) in a libel action. Some of it is simply repulsive and goes well beyond the bounds of legitimate political debate. But if you sincerely believe that you are entitled to fight dirty like this because you feel your opponents are fighting dirty against you, then you are no better are you?
word of mouth
says...
9:29pm Tue 15 Sep 09
we digress, well said katie local politics is all a bit bitchey built on cheap shots at there opponents.
Katie Rolt
says...
9:31pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Perhaps the Guardian could ask Cllr Murray to produce a description of a BNP supporter. You cannot tell what political party someone supports by just looking at them, unless they are carrying a banner of course! Not to mention most youth people have turned their back on politics.
Such statements as that made by Cllr Murray does sound similar to the sort of thing Noor Ramnajally was saying before his arrest, so I take it with a large pinch of salt.
"who personally abused me shouting across the fields at me. They were saying 'You should apologise. You got it wrong.'" - Cllr Stephen Murray. No Cllr Murray, they weren’t abusing you, they were stating the bloody obvious!
Maurice Stoker
says...
9:31pm Tue 15 Sep 09
I am thinking of taking out a patent to go on the dragons den and produce a BBQ lighting fuel, Doggie doo doo lighting fuel. There is an abundance of it free on the footpaths these days.
Maurice Stoker
says...
9:33pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton wrote:I have never in my days heard of Doggie doo doo being inflammable.
I totally sympathise with Mr Murray, although I don't know him. I am white, my wife is Asian and we have a three-year-old son. Ever since we moved to Loughton two years ago my wife and son have been subjected to racist harassment. At 1am last May we had dog poo set alight on our doorstep by someone shouting "Go home ****". My wife and son have had youths and grown men shout "****" at them in the street and on a couple of occasions they have been aggressive and frightened my wife and son. I blame this entirely on the BNP and their councillors. We've lived in many places and got along with people of all backgrounds. It is only in Loughton that we've faced these problems and this is the only place we have lived with BNP councillors. We just want to get along in life without causing a fuss, so we haven't run to the media or make a point. But the BNP has created a poisonous and ugly atmosphere in this town which makes it impossible to live here comfortably if you are not white. The issue of the Muslim prayer group and the guy who has been charged have now made it even more difficult for us. We don't think anyone would believe us if we report race hate crimes against us because of what has now happened. We don't want to bring our son up in Loughton. It is simply not a healthy place to live. And so we are moving from this town. The BNP are getting what they wanted. Non-white people are not welcome here, even if they are law-abiding people like us who are not interested in mosques or any political agenda but just want to live peacefully with our neighbours. The BNP is right. While race hatred is sustained, Loughton will remain white. But at what cost?
I am thinking of taking out a patent to go on the dragons den and produce a BBQ lighting fuel, Doggie doo doo lighting fuel. There is an abundance of it free on the footpaths these days.
Tsoom
says...
9:38pm Tue 15 Sep 09
paul101 wrote:Nick Griffin has a conviction for incitement to racial hatred for material denying the Holocaust, for which he got a suspended jail sentence.
You had better check your facts Tsoom, has he a conviction for that?
You are showing now your real inability to perceive propaganda.
Again stick to the facts! You wont find them in Anti-BNP propaganda!
Neither will you find them in the Media. Go to source. If The BNP is anti semetic then why is Pat Richardson the Lead councillor?
Now, to the matter of Pat Richardson. There are, let's be polite about this, 'eccentrics' in every community. The Jewish community is no exception. There are some extremists called Netauri Karta who associate with antisemitic Islamist groups. Then there is Pat Richardson who associates with the antisemitic BNP. I'm just guessing here, but as a Jew I think that Jews like Richardson are numbered in single figures.
I understand that Richardson is the daughter of Romanian Jewish refugees. If the BNP's immigration and asylum policy was in place during the 1930s and 1940s, she would not be alive today. By joining the BNP, she is behaving in the most treacherous and hypocritical fashion, operating as a fig leaf for fascism. She is the leader of the BNP's Jüdische Ghetto-Polizei and should be treated as such. As a Jew, she churns my stomach more than the Netauri Karta.
Maurice Stoker
says...
9:43pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Tsoom
says...
9:52pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Maurice Stoker wrote:Maurice: There's nothing unbelievable about. It is a form of harassment commonly used in Halloween. The idea is to fill up a bag with dog mess and pour lighter fuel over it, ring the bell and light it, when the occupant comes out they stamp it out and in doing so get dog mess over their feet. In this case, the intention was racial harassment.
I have never in my days heard of Doggie doo doo being inflammable.
I am thinking of taking out a patent to go on the dragons den and produce a BBQ lighting fuel, Doggie doo doo lighting fuel. There is an abundance of it free on the footpaths these days.
SylvieM
says...
10:44pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Lyn Martin
says...
11:37pm Tue 15 Sep 09
bertie_bert
says...
9:08am Wed 16 Sep 09
bertie_bert
says...
9:53am Wed 16 Sep 09
http://www.thegreena
rrow.co.uk/index.php
/writers/arrow-strai
ght/154-another-alie
n-attack-in-epping-f
orest
Tsoom
says...
10:14am Wed 16 Sep 09
So, what are you going to do to stop non-white people buying or renting houses in Loughton and moving here? Smash up their shops and homes? Pat Richardson says that breaking windows is a 'British way' of showing discontent. Will she be leading a Kristallnacht in Loughton to keep it Asian-free? I just wonder what the BNP's policy is to keep Loughton white. It seems one person here has spoken of how his family feel unable to live in the town due to racist bullying by the locals, encouraged no doubt by the BNP's racist leafleting.
Maurice Stoker
says...
10:23am Wed 16 Sep 09
Tsoom wrote:I see, I did not realise. A very unpleasant experience no doubt and probably from the USA?
Maurice Stoker wrote:Maurice: There's nothing unbelievable about. It is a form of harassment commonly used in Halloween. The idea is to fill up a bag with dog mess and pour lighter fuel over it, ring the bell and light it, when the occupant comes out they stamp it out and in doing so get dog mess over their feet. In this case, the intention was racial harassment.
I have never in my days heard of Doggie doo doo being inflammable.
I am thinking of taking out a patent to go on the dragons den and produce a BBQ lighting fuel, Doggie doo doo lighting fuel. There is an abundance of it free on the footpaths these days.
When the people keep saying that Muslims should integrate more, integrate into what British society?
Do they want Muslims to integrate into the drug, binge drinking, teen pregnancy, yobbish feral, crime ridden, single parent, chav celebrity society?
No wonder they like to stick to their own!
warichunt
says...
10:32am Wed 16 Sep 09
Morris Hickey
says...
10:43am Wed 16 Sep 09
Tsoom
says...
10:44am Wed 16 Sep 09
Maurice Stoker wrote:I am sure we can find examples of bad behaviour in all societies. The only requirements I think should be expected for integration are to obey the law and learn English. Beyond that, what god(s) you worship, who you marry, your aspirations and your sexual preferences are no business of the state. But the BNP, as an authoritarian party, wants to make these the business of the state in order to impose conformity to their ideas of "British values". That's why they want the state to ban Islam, mixed marriage and homosexuality, among other things. And I don't think they'd just stop at these easy targets - Jews, who they believe are a pernicious force in society, would also be eradicated in one way or another under a BNP government. People hate state intrusion into their lives and they hate state terrorism, so they shouldn't vote BNP. The interesting thing is that the BNP, in seeking to impose a highly authoritarian government, utilises football hooligans and thugs with dogs who had no respect for the law.
Tsoom wrote:I see, I did not realise. A very unpleasant experience no doubt and probably from the USA?
Maurice Stoker wrote:Maurice: There's nothing unbelievable about. It is a form of harassment commonly used in Halloween. The idea is to fill up a bag with dog mess and pour lighter fuel over it, ring the bell and light it, when the occupant comes out they stamp it out and in doing so get dog mess over their feet. In this case, the intention was racial harassment.
I have never in my days heard of Doggie doo doo being inflammable.
I am thinking of taking out a patent to go on the dragons den and produce a BBQ lighting fuel, Doggie doo doo lighting fuel. There is an abundance of it free on the footpaths these days.
When the people keep saying that Muslims should integrate more, integrate into what British society?
Do they want Muslims to integrate into the drug, binge drinking, teen pregnancy, yobbish feral, crime ridden, single parent, chav celebrity society?
No wonder they like to stick to their own!
UKIP Voter
says...
11:50am Wed 16 Sep 09
Interesting because not only does this Cllr assume that the lad/s calling him names and stating that he should apologise are BNP supporters, reading further so it seems do many of the commentators!
How do you know that the lad/s are not Conservative or Labour supporters! Why just assume that they are not.
The area where i live is totally Conservative, in fact i don't think i've ever seen a BNP leaflet, i've read plenty of lies and conjecture concerning the BNP but never believe all i read in the newspapers and on TV.
In fact a lot of what i read about this party is becoming farcical.
'quote'
Tsoom, Loughton says...
6:26pm Tue 15 Sep 09
Frank Forte speaks from his moral highground, but he has a conviction for actual bodily harm: 'unquote'
After reading the above i googled for convictions for political parties and came across this
http://liarsbuggersa
ndthieves.blogspot.c
om/
Not being one to take things at face value i did a little research in to these Councillors and it seems this blogspot naming these creatures is in fact accurate.
What actually is threatening in being told 'you were wrong, you shoild apologise'!
Seems to me this Cllr is just trying to stir trouble, not a very attractive trait in anyone!
Maurice Stoker
says...
12:03pm Wed 16 Sep 09
What makes it amusing is that most of these comments against Muslim are from people who probably go down their favourite curry restaurant on a Saturday Night and Curry favour (no pun intended with the owner.
Tsoom
says...
2:04pm Wed 16 Sep 09
Tsoom
says...
2:21pm Wed 16 Sep 09
Morris Hickey
says...
5:45pm Wed 16 Sep 09
w-evr
says...
7:33pm Wed 16 Sep 09
w-evr
says...
9:15pm Wed 16 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton
says...
10:08pm Wed 16 Sep 09
Sick of Loughton
says...
10:10pm Wed 16 Sep 09
girlfromessex
says...
11:11pm Wed 16 Sep 09
As for people being taunted or abused because they are asian or any other ethnicity, that is equally terrible, and again not the behaviour most local residents want in Loughton.
Finally, Cllr Murray has a fantastic reputation for standing up for his community and everyone is his ward knows that he works incredibly hard for his constituants. We should be proud to have councillors like Stephen Murray in Loughton, not abuse him in this way. It really isn't funny - it is bullying behaviour, pure and simple.
It is funny but any article or post about the BNP ends up with them abusing and insulting everyone, and what they say usually has nothing to do with the subject under discussion.
For goodness sake, will you all get a grip and start thinking of ways we can get rid of the thug element in Loughton - you only have to go down the Broadway in the evening and the local chavs are there in force. If it was a choice between living with them or with asian people who are, on the whole, decent and hardworking, I know which lot I would choose. Oh yes - I am white and not moving anywhere.
ConcernedofLoughton
says...
9:04am Thu 17 Sep 09
HarryD
says...
10:00am Thu 17 Sep 09
ConcernedofLoughton
says...
11:18am Thu 17 Sep 09
Even if I did agree with their views on race and immigration then I still wouldnt vote for them as they are a one issue party. This was clearly shown by their Epping Forest Residents site which dealt with little else except portraying muslims in a bad light.
HarryD
says...
1:33pm Thu 17 Sep 09
Maurice Stoker
says...
9:04pm Thu 17 Sep 09
HarryD wrote:I totally agree. It would seem that the BNP want the Asian community to integrate into the vomiting, feral, 6 cans for a fiver, never do good, F grade,
girlfromessex said the most sensible thing here. The trouble is that now we have the BNP in Loughton, local politics is all about race and immigration when most of us want the drunken yobs (sorry to say they are all white skinned) off the streets, clean the town up, deal with parking problems and other stuff. The only people who talk about that are the residents association and thats why I vote for them. The BNP's politics are just not going to solve local problems because we dont have a problem with Asians or Blacks or Chinese.
Roast Beef eating, Land of Dope and Glory, Lagar down yer throat and Gregory Peck, Jobless, never seen working in a McDonalds, Gambling, only attend Church at Funeral, Christmas Jolly up more booze, pregnant at 14, steal off your Grandma society. I have only met calm and peaceful Muslims personally but know and am aware that some want to blow up the planes as much as generally white people want to rob the banks and do the white collar criminal activities on 'their babies life I did not do it' crimes rubbish. I have never heard of a Muslim raping and Murdering old folk.
UKIP Voter
says...
10:38pm Thu 17 Sep 09
9:04pm Thu 17 Sep 09
I have never heard of a Muslim raping and Murdering old folk.
Really! then a quick google search should give you some answers!
“We don’t make a distinction between civilians and non-civilians, innocents and non-innocents. Only between Muslims and unbelievers. And the life of an unbeliever has no value. It has no sanctity.”
467 rapes against children under the age of 15 were reported in 2004 compared with 258 in 1995. Legal proceedings continue this week in a case involving a 13 year old girl from Motala who was said to have been subjected to a group rape by four men. (Note: These four men were Kurdish Muslims, who raped the girl for hours and even took photos of doing so)
http://barenakedisla
m.wordpress.com/2009
/04/16/rape-by-musli
ms-epidemic-in-europ
e-and-headed-this-wa
y-now-that-islamobam
a-wants-to-increase-
muslim-immigration-t
o-the-us/
or how about this just a few weeks ago!
Muslim cops get death for rape and murder of 3-year old
http://infidelsunite
.typepad.com/counter
_jihad/2009/08/musli
m-cops-get-death-for
-rape-and-murder-of-
3year-old.html
HarryD
says...
11:18pm Thu 17 Sep 09
sarah j smith
says...
2:46pm Fri 18 Sep 09
So cut the crap and stop using him for your anger over the fake kidnap victim save that for him.
Also stephen is the man his father was and more just ask his mum, a true and loyal son brother uncle and friend a very commited man in everything he does....ps that picture of him is shocking and worse still that is his own coat hahaha stephen one bit of advice,,,, hit the cake shop!!!!!!!!!!
girlfromessex
says...
4:57pm Fri 18 Sep 09
Back to the point, Cllr Murray says he was attacked. He appears to be an honourable man and we should be supporting our elected representative against a group of local thugs.
I had always heard that the reason why many conservative voters don't vote UKIP is because they are too far on the right. I didn't believe that until now..... Your posts are making me wonder now if there is any difference between the BNP and UKIP.
Johnny Boy
says...
12:23pm Sat 19 Sep 09
Back then Mr Murray was kind and considerate, a man of integrity and principles, he actually cared about people and still does.
I have lived most of my life in Loughton and find it sad to hear his good name smeared like this.
w-evr
says...
12:39pm Sat 19 Sep 09
Katie Rolt says...
6:21pm Mon 14 Sep 09
Cllr Stephen Murray shares the same political agenda Noor Ramjanally. How do BNP come in tothis? Perhaps the youths thought he was a plank for supporting a man (Noor Ramjanally) who lied to the Police and tried to stir up race relations in Loughton.
Its a shame Stephen isn't half the man is father was.